It's so sad to see a question to sit on 1 point of karma when it has sparked a good discussion with 4-5 replies, or just one reply that got 10+ points. Sure, karma doesn't matter, and yet it shapes what we do on a subconscious level. Upvote good questions, it will make HN a better site!
Yeah, it seems to me like the ideal weighting scheme would operate on (sub-)threads rather than individual comments, i.e. take the descendants' karma into account in some way when ranking posts.
If a bad question provokes good answers, then I don't see how it could have been bad to begin with.
The contrast I think of is in a classroom. If a student asks an ignorant question (is there another instance of "bad"?), isn't that a good thing? For them and for the other students?
It can happen in a classroom setting, where a class clown asks or makes a comment intended for a laugh. Good teachers can flip them around and use them as segues into meaningful discussion.
You'd think, but in an online forum it doesn't work that way.
For an example of this, see below for my intentionally contentious comment "questions aren't a contribution". It evoked some high voted comments, and yet the comment itself has been down-voted as having "no value".
The irony of this is that it kind of proves my contention in the first place. The value of a comment is more about the response it generates than the comment itself. As you say, an ignorant student may start a worthwhile discussion, but it doesn't make the student (or their question) any less ignorant.
My comment was rightfully down-voted for not contributing value to the discussion, even though the comments that stemmed from it do. The OP contends that if a question generates a vigorous discussion, then it must have it's own intrinsic value....which clearly is not the case. If it did, my worthless comment would have the sum value of it's child comments and therefore be the top rated comment of the thread. Quite the paradox.
Every comment is (and should be) treated on its merits. A question with interesting answers doesn't mean the question itself was interesting or worthy of praise. "Why is the sky blue?", "Why do stars sparkle?", "What makes a rainbow" are all pretty dull kiddy questions, but they all have interesting answers.
Some questions are insightful. Others are important, and should be addresses as part of the discussion. I will often upvote questions that do not yet have an answer, but I would like to have an answer to. I upvote such questions both to attain such answers, and to encourage people to continue asking such questions.
I have a lot of trouble understanding the role of comments online where I don't see them in real life. Questions, by contrast, are perhaps the earliest form of social cognition. The two seem to represent entirely separate information channels. Why not embrace the distinction?
My worry too, but comments are completely unbounded. Which complexity is worse?
It's really no surprise that trolls run rampant in comment threads. Commenting requires no social mores. By contrast, questions require consideration of another. Sure, trolls can be silly in questions but there's almost no power in dumb questions. A question is not only inherently social but brings humility along for the discourse.
I'm not sure I see the distinction. You and I could have a discussion for an hour and I can walk away not sure of what transpired. It feels like something has happened but the outcome is unbounded, sort of like comment threads.
By contrast, I could ask you a series of questions, even open-ended ones, and it will be pretty clear what the takeaways are. I'll know clearly what you think. And if not, I can always ask another question.
Are questions though really a part of any discussion? How often do we see the "?" in threads here. It doesn't feel all that often and this is one of the best places online for discussions.
Two helpful concepts here are "debate" and "interview". They're two very different forms of communication, right?
It's a soft distinction, one of implication. I think we have discussions here. I think of "comments" as shouting in the ether, and that's usually not what we do.
I disagree that the series of questions will necessarily result in a better understanding. Any meaningful set of questions will involve two-way communication for clarification, which quickly becomes what I call a discussion. Debate and interview are different, but I think HN comment threads are neither.
I frequently see questions in HN threads. I sometimes ask them.
If someone replied to a post with, "You're wrong and an idiot," but the original poster replies with a reasoned defense, then I would certainly vote down the first reply and vote up the second.
If someone is trolling with a dumb comment like, "Capitalism never works," but then receives well-thought out replies as to why capitalism does in fact work in this situation, then I would leave the original comment alone and vote up the replies.
I agree, with the disclaimer (as you pointed out) that it also has some good discussion. I'm all for making sure the question is answered, but asking a question in and of itself doesn't contribute much if the answer is simple.
similarly, on a side note here... but if you post an AskHN post wanting feedback on your product and idea it would be great if you could also take time to respond to those who bother to feed back for you. often I'm left wondering if they've ever returned to pick up the fb that I and others have taken time to write.
The "great conversation" is the part that creates the value. Not the parent. My own point here has no value on its own other than the fact that it started further discussion. It doesn't make my comment any more valuable in its own right.
Indeed, it has a social component embedded in its very nature. I don't see the same of comments. I could make comments about anything in life - code, food, movies, people, etc. - and it doesn't matter if anyone else cares. Questions though are pointless if they don't engender a response.
Socrates is generally thought to have made some contributions to philosophy despite the fact that the Socratic Method basically boils down to "ask lots of questions."
Good questions get upvoted on their own.