For my company, we don't have complex chains, but generally are giving a large context and looking to get structured outputs. Curious how this could help with that? We don't currently use any eval frameworks.
That's a great use case of Nomadic!
We support many Eval frameworks in the optimization, but one is a LLM-as-a-Judge model, where you can input custom weights based on your metrics of interest! Adhering to a proper structure could be one of them :-)
Hey! You can use Explo to explore your database and visualize data, but it requires using SQL to initially access to data so it is not completely visual.
Retool is a great example of a tool that we feel is adjacent to us but different specifically because it is not built to be customer facing. You can expose a retool dashboard but it isn't built to be embedded natively into your web app and there is no way to customize the styles to fit your app.
Additionally, our charts, visualizations, and data representations are much more catered to application dashboards - whereas retool has generic charting components in a more raw form.
Super interesting (and thorough) thread of thoughts, thanks for sharing!
We are definitely hoping to launch self serve in the near future but have decided not to while we iterate on the core features and ensure things work with a qualified and controlled set of customers. However, it is helpful to understand how important self serve is to developers.
1. We have a few customers who have switched over from Metabase for a few different reasons. The main ones are that we offer much more extensive UI components, more chart capabilities, better security guarantees, and highly customizable styles. While $500 is more than Metabase's price point, we believe that an embedded first solution is worth the price since it will save you 10-20x the cost per month on development and maintenance costs.
2. Yes! A dashboard is just a collection of one or more charts/UI elements and so if you make a "dashboard" which is just a single chart, you can easily embed that. We have many customers who have this use case to embed analytics granularly throughout their app.
3. Not currently, though I'd love to understand more about how/why you would want that. We've heard this a few times as a "nice to have" but would love to build it out with a customer that really needs it.
4. It sounds like you'd be a great customer for Explo! It takes all of the hard work of building out user interfaces out of the equation and makes it so that you just need to specify data queries with SQL and then use our drag and drop interface for UI building.
Hi, really appreciate the feedback! I 100% agree that the way we handle initial page load is not ideal and is an area I have been meaning to prioritize for some time. We've just been swamped with other customer requests for new UI interface and charting functionality.
I am curious your thoughts on a better way to approach this. My initial thought is for a single loading state which ends when all the data is ready to display on the page. It feels inevitable that there is some loading moment when we are fetching the data. It sounds like, based on your comment, that you would prefer there to be no loading state thought?
Precompute whatever you can I guess, but I'm guessing the app has parameterized queries and stuff like that which are hard to precompute. In that case even a cache or LRU list is fine, say precomputing the handful of most common views people will encounter most often.
Imagine even if only Jira's new ticket page and 'open tickets' search result were pre-rendered so loading them took <200ms. The amount of hate would probably drop by 90%
Separately if you can reduce the workflow for a page from being a task in its own right (most of which is waiting around) to something as simple as a click, it can increase user confidence a lot. If something that took 5 seconds (+4 of which is just waiting) suddenly completes in 200/300ms, folk learn new tricks for your tool, like middle-clicking open a bunch of screens, or noticing they can open and close it much more easily. It makes the whole experience feel more agile, which definitely has an effect on loyalty
That is cool use case for customer facing analytics/information!
Every part of what you described other than the actual QR code generation is possible today! For each user input in the dashboard, URL parameters can be defined to default the input to a specific value on page load.
Your point around using the Explo dashboard to show more information is super relevant to one of the longer term ways that we are thinking about our product. Rather than just typical "dashboards", what we've built with Explo is a way to create user interfaces that share and communicate data. And we want to take it a step further since we've realized that a lot of web development and user interfaces is really just visualizing and communicating data.
Hi, thanks for the thoughts and glad to hear this could be useful for you! Startups and smaller companies we work with are paying $500/month (pretty cheap for replacing months of engineering working and maintenance). Our pricing then goes up from there depending on number of end customer groups.
We work with our clients on how the pricing scales up since some customers have very few end customer groups with tons of usage, whereas some customers have tens of thousands of end customer groups by virtue of being more consumer facing.
Let me know if you have more specific questions about pricing!
Thank you for your response. I work in big corp. I think it is much easier for us to make something ourselves then to go through sales cycle/approvals to get us to use this.
Having said that, I look forward seeing what you will do in next year or two.
“I think it is much easier for us to make something ourselves”
says every developer until burning 100x cost/resources/time building a lesser version of the same thing that has to be now documented, supported and maintained.
From what I know (especially for big corps) $6k annual contract value ($500p/m) can usually be put on a credit card without triggering any lengthy enterprise 6-18 months sales cycles.
Hi! We offer different pricing packages since we work with a varied set of companies that use the product in different ways. Some example use cases: metrics and data viz on a landing page, admin panel dashboards, billing dashboards, custom dashboard share links, etc. Depending on your use case we'd be happy to chat more and figure out a pricing model that makes sense for you.
In general we don't charge for # of dashboards or even traffic to the dashboards. We charge based on the # of end customer groups you are presenting dashboards to. This has been the most aligned with our customers since you can use the full power of the tool and only pay more as your own business scales up.
Just note that for some people, no pricing means "enterprise"/expensive. (I never even consider a product without transparent pricing myself, but others have had more success with this approach).
Got it - thanks for the feedback. To be transparent, startups and smaller companies we work with are paying $500/month (pretty cheap for replacing months of engineering working and maintenance). Our pricing then goes up from there depending on number of end customer groups.
We work with our clients on how the pricing scales up since some customers have very few end customer groups with tons of usage, whereas some customers have tens of thousands of end customer groups by virtue of being more consumer facing.
Let me know if you have more specific questions about pricing!
"startups and smaller companies we work with are paying $500/month. Our pricing then goes up from there depending on number of end customer groups." It's totally fine to be transparent about the starting price, since you appear to have one.
would make an excellent entry in a FAQ on the site. Likely would help qualify leads as well.
(I don't have any issue with the pricing, but would also not reach out given no pricing typically means "really expensive".)
To echo the above sentiments, no pricing is also synonymous with enterprise for me and I don't give any consideration to products without transparent pricing at all.
That makes sense. We are definitely not trying to hide an outrageous enterprise price tag. I responded to mchusma's comment with how our pricing currently works. Let me know if you have any specific questions about it and happy to dive deeper!
Would it be possible to put it in print where we could find it without iteration over the same query on a third party news aggregation website which is likely to never be found by anyone who could benefit from your services?
Thanks for the suggestion! We are mostly migrated over to Highcharts, though we have a few customers using legacy charts in some of the other libraries you mentioned. We've talked about how we want to build our own visualizations with more low level concepts (mostly haven't due to resource constraints), and visx looks like a really solid place to start.
To your point, we have already had a few customers that display their dashboards on mobile web apps and have had a few native applications want to use us.
Looking at where highcharts are today, I might have jumped the gun on that comment as they have come a long way. Three years ago we were using them. After I built our React Native version of the data dashboard I was giving the hard requirement to implement charts on mobile of which there weren't any out of the box solutions for at the time. Nonetheless, if you find yourself needing to implement custom charts especially if you have larger customers previously using Tableau or if you want custom branded charts, I do recommend considering visx.
Just to add another recommendation to the mix. I'm an extremely happy echarts user. I recently had somebody comment about the graph that was in my product as they were surprised by how it was done, which goes to show how flexible and powerful echarts is.
If you go to https://public-001.gitsense.com/insights/github/repos?r=gith... and look at the timeline chart, you can see that it is pretty flexible. I was able to convert a scatter chart into the timeline chart which supports scrolling left and right fairly easily.
This is super cool, thanks for sharing! I am always excited to see dashboards in different large products because it helps us understand how to push our product to make it so that the dashboard is buildable in Explo.
No problem. I'm also planning on open sourcing the frontend when I have the available resources as the value is really with the data. If others want to learn from what I've done and/or use it to integrate into their own solutions, that's perfectly fine by me.
